Moshe Arens says it much better than me

6 Comments

1. AMRILUSAGUY says:

   August 3, 2011 at 3:43 pm

   He might but he is ultimately part of the oligarchy as well.

   From another thread a forex person tried to explain to me how israel was so much better of because the shekel had risen in value.

   I find that argument specious because while the shekel might buy more dollars today than it did 4 years ago, I can not do anything with the shekel outside of israel, while even though china might laugh at the dollar if you dont have enough of theirs you can pay for the cab with green backs – they wont take shekels.

   and if it is so that the shekel is worth so much more today than it used to be how come i can but so much less with each one of them to day than I could 4 years ago?

   Maybe the only solution is turning rothchild way into tahrir square?
2. Zendette says:

   August 3, 2011 at 5:33 pm

   Agreed, although I doubt he sees himself as such.

   Food prices have risen, worldwide. I was shocked that in Ukraine, where the average monthly wage is less than $200, the prices in supermarkets were similar to the prices in Israel. I’ve spoken to Ukrainian Israelis who confirm that food prices are very high compared to wages. Meat is actually cheaper than here, not that you would touch any of it.

   The real question is quality of life, and Israelis tend to give a pretty high grade to their quality of life, notwithstanding housing prices. Then again, housing prices here have always been high due to land limitations and

   One major difference in apartment expectations in Israel today, compared to 40 years ago, is that now many families want a separate bedroom for each child. Years ago, a three room apartment was a luxury, where all children slept on one bedroom, parents in the second, and the third room was the living room. I know middle class people who grew up in 2 room apartments in Tel Aviv. The children slept on beds that opened up each evening in the living room, while the parents slept in the smaller room. Kind of like Moscow.

   We need to focus on quality of life, not monetary comparisons. I think your earlier point about the disappearing middle class is spot on. Society seems to be moving to the extremes with the working poor the new middle class.
3. Dana says:

   August 12, 2011 at 8:26 am

   I know I am getting into this one kind of late and indeed on some level Israel protesting for decent housing in a thriving economy while much of the rest of the world is on life support seems silly. I think the point of this article though is that Israel is still way better off than the Arab countries and that is true. Israelis have the opportunity through elections to unseat the government if they are not happy with it (and they should) and the Egyptians may have sparked a freedom movement with their uprising but what have they really gained? More of the same.

   I can’t say much of the housing market in IL as it is nearly a decade since I have lived there but I do know it is very difficult in IL to live a decent lifestyle without being in debt to the bank, when I lived there most Israelis I knew had to live ‘in the minus’ in order to maintain their lifestyle and when their credit ran out, they just arranged more. I understand that in the last years the banks have had to become stricter in their lending practices which of course spills over into mortgages. Israel is one of the few countries I know where it is cheaper to rent than to buy. On top of that, Israel is similar with the rest of the world that wages do not increase at the same rate as inflation so life becomes more costly but you earn the same which means that you are worse off with your 8500 sheks per month times two.
4. AMRILUSAGUY says:

   August 18, 2011 at 8:16 am

   Dana
   I think the best example of the types of issues being raised and that need to be solved is this:
   in 2008 gasoline in israel broached 7 NIS for the first time and a barrel of crude was 150 dollars. Now crude is at 86 or so and gasoline for self service is 7.22.

   The Indirect Taxes Israelis pay are 60%!! higher than the average OECD country at 16% of the GDP. This is what needs to be changed. this is what people are up in arms about.
5. Dana says:

   August 18, 2011 at 8:06 pm

   Thanks for the clarifications, appreciate that Amrilusaguy.

   Regarding gasoline, I think IL is not alone in that, in both EU and the US although the price has gone down, consumers don’t have that at the pump. I am not sure what indirect taxes are. Would love an explanation if you care to give one.
6. Zendette says:

   August 25, 2011 at 6:06 pm

   Now I’m returning to this discussion late. AMR, you bring up the question of high taxes, but also consider what we get for our taxes. Most importantly, Israel has a huge amount of defense expense. Not sure what the breakdown of our taxes is, but I’m certain a good portion goes for security and defense.

   Also, some taxes, much as I hate paying them, actually make sense. For example, the high taxes on private vehicles is logical when we have too many cars on the roads of such a small country. Ditto on gas prices. It wouldn’t hurt to increase vice taxes on cigarettes and alcohol either. Taxation should be both a function of govt. revenue generation as well as a method for putting public policy into action. As a Dem, I would have thought you’d agree.